ScummVM IRC Log - 07 Nov 2021

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[00:02] <Scummette> [scummvm] sluicebox pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXTjv
[00:02] <Scummette> scummvm/master 16bf767 sluicebox: CREATE_PROJECT: Add --include-dir and --library-dir
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[00:08] <Scummette> [scummvm] digitall pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXkqv
[00:08] <Scummette> scummvm/master ff4cd45 digitall: WINTERMUTE: Fix Duplicated Branch GCC Warnings
[00:26] <Scummette> [scummvm] gingerbeardman opened pull request #3495: DEVTOOLS: MacJapanese mapping of SHIFT-JIS range, log levels, typo fixes (master...master) https://git.io/JXkoF
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[02:42] <Scummette> [scummvm] ScummVM-Translations pushed 5 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXt5Z
[02:42] <Scummette> scummvm/master 76f7d40 sev-: I18N: Update translation (Danish)
[02:42] <Scummette> scummvm/master 74f222f sev-: I18N: Update translation (Dutch)
[02:42] <Scummette> scummvm/master 0d5d4d3 sev-: I18N: Update translation (Swedish)
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[03:25] <Scummette> [scummvm] sluicebox pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXq1I
[03:25] <Scummette> scummvm/master 91bf813 sluicebox: SCI32: Remove kFileIOReadString warning
[03:25] <Scummette> [scummvm] ScummVM-Translations pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXq18
[03:26] <Scummette> scummvm/master 6cf55f9 : I18N: Update translation files
[03:26] <Scummette> scummvm/master d88333e : I18N: Update translations templates
[03:39] <Scummette> [scummvm] mistydemeo opened pull request #3496: DIRECTOR: close file handles when no stream created (master...sound_close_streams) https://git.io/JXqpU
[03:53] <Scummette> [scummvm] moralrecordings pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXm3k
[03:53] <Scummette> scummvm/master 53da0c8 moralrecordings: DIRECTOR: Fix file handle leak in getAudioStream
[03:53] <Scummette> [scummvm] ScummVM-Translations pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXm3u
[03:53] <Scummette> scummvm/master 77dd71f : I18N: Update translation files
[03:59] <Scummette> [scummvm] moralrecordings pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXmWp
[03:59] <Scummette> scummvm/master af69978 moralrecordings: DIRECTOR: Add Total Distortion demo
[03:59] <Scummette> scummvm/master 6d32f57 moralrecordings: DIRECTOR: Rework film loops to render as channels
[04:00] <Scummette> [scummvm] moralrecordings closed pull request #3494: DIRECTOR: Rework film loops to render as channels (master...filmloops) https://git.io/JXeiq
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[05:45] <Scummette> [scummvm] mistydemeo opened pull request #3497: DIRECTOR: handle macbinary audio streams (master...director_handle_macbinary_audio) https://git.io/JXOGF
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[05:53] <Scummette> [scummvm] sluicebox opened pull request #3498: CREATE_PROJECT: Remove VS2008 project generator (master...remove-vs2008) https://git.io/JXO4T
[06:00] <Scummette> [scummvm] sev- closed pull request #3496: DIRECTOR: close file handles when no stream created (master...sound_close_streams) https://git.io/JXqpU
[06:00] <Scummette> [scummvm] sev- pushed 0 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXOzM
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[07:13] <grogbot> <jakejakejake1234> Hey there everyone. I just wanted to let you guys know that I have finished a document which contains all the code that restores the majority of the content of the blade runner game. It took me months to complete and I had to learn the code and it took up most of my spare time but it was worth it. Feel free to have a look and you guys can use the code in any way that you want.
[07:13] <grogbot> <jakejakejake1234> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/581224061091446795/906805009923080212/Blade_runner_restored_code.docx
[07:17] <grogbot> <jakejakejake1234> The one thing that we can't implement however is a part of the game where you could here Roy Battys monologue if you went to the Bradbury roof in act 5. Louis Castle the original game designer talked highly of this moment but it seems that the lines aren't in the game files. So I guess I'll give you guys the next best thing. https://youtu.be/HU7Ga7qTLDU
[07:18] <grogbot> <jakejakejake1234> Anyway guys I appreciate you giving me the opportunity to work on this project with you. Thank you.
[08:02] <grogbot> <rootfather> Hold on a second - 400 PAGES?!
[08:02] <grogbot> <rootfather> The amount of time and work you invested there must have been tremendous!
[08:13] <grogbot> <sev> Yes, I am sure, you could help with the code with your energy and time. I offer my help. See DM
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[09:08] <grogbot> <eientei> Huh, found a bug in ScummVM wrt the Full Throttle demo. Click on something (I presume) you're not meant to and in DOS the screen shakes. In ScummVM, the screen just drifts downward and back
[09:08] <grogbot> <eientei> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/581224061091446795/906834096553082951/ft_000.avi
[09:10] <grogbot> <eientei> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/581224061091446795/906834394793259038/ft_000.webm
[09:23] <grogbot> <eientei> Ah cool room 10, script 301
[09:24] <Scummette> [scummvm] sluicebox opened pull request #3499: WIN32: Add Portable Mode (master...win-portable) https://git.io/JXGno
[09:30] <Scummette> [scummvm] bluegr closed pull request #3498: CREATE_PROJECT: Remove VS2008 project generator (master...remove-vs2008) https://git.io/JXO4T
[09:30] <Scummette> [scummvm] bluegr pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXG4Y
[09:30] <Scummette> scummvm/master 76778e1 sluicebox: CREATE_PROJECT: Remove VS2008 project generator
[09:43] <grogbot> <antoniou79> Re: Blade Runner restored content. I can use jake's document for cross reference, and help for the most puzzling cases, but I do have a plan already for most of the content. I'm thankful for the work you put into this @jakejakejake1234; we already occasionally chat in PM, so you know where I'm coming from. 400 pages are a lot to go through, but also a tremendous amount of work on your part.
[09:44] <grogbot> <antoniou79> If anyone goes ahead and implements jake's suggestions, I'll take a look as a second pass later on or discuss on a case by case basis on a potential PR.
[09:45] <grogbot> <antoniou79> I wish I had more spare time these days, to be able to work more on the Restored Content, on my task list and probably jake's, but my schedule is not looking good for the month.
[10:03] <grogbot> <gingerbeardman> I just noticed the the invite in #scummvm-retroarch has expired
[10:19] <grogbot> <Henke37> could you please use the testbed to check if it's a backend issue?
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[10:22] <logix> jakejakejake1234: awesome work!
[10:30] <grogbot> <eientei> How do I use testbed?
[10:31] <grogbot> <Henke37> add it like a game. the folder is dists\engine-data\testbed-audiocd-files
[10:52] <grogbot> <eientei> Out of the graphics tests: MouseMovements - the cursor is moved to the top-left of the rectangle, not centred as described shakingEffect - No graphics are on screen to shake Additionally VerifyErrorMessages failed on FS tests
[10:53] <grogbot> <eientei> SDL backend, ScummVM v2.5.0 (Arch package version 2.5.0-4)
[10:59] <Scummette> [scummvm] aquadran opened pull request #3500: SURFACESDL: Implemented fallback in case lack of VSYNC (master...sdl-vsync) https://git.io/JXZ22
[11:05] <grogbot> <Henke37> how peculiar, it obviously shouldn't fail the shaking test
[11:06] <grogbot> <Henke37> the mouse tests are know, at least to me, to be broken.
[12:14] <grogbot> <eriktorbjorn> Looks like it only has time for three "shake frames" before the shaking is turned off. Those have Y offset 0, 2 and 4 respectively. I have no idea why, though.
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[12:50] <grogbot> <athrxx> @eientei Could you please also check with VSync on and off? That seems to be our newest source for that kind of issues...
[12:57] <grogbot> <eientei> Same screen movements with vsync on (as was previously) and off
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[13:09] <Scummette> [scummvm] eriktorbjorn pushed 2 new commits to branch-2-5: https://git.io/JXckZ
[13:09] <Scummette> scummvm/branch-2-5 e7c345f eriktorbjorn: SCUMM: DiMUSE: Backport fix for looping Dig music (bug #13058)
[13:09] <Scummette> scummvm/branch-2-5 bcd7823 eriktorbjorn: NEWS: Mention looping music fix in The Dig
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[13:34] <grogbot> <eientei> Finally managed to get a video of what it appears on my machine in ScummVM
[13:34] <grogbot> <eientei> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/581224061091446795/906900965259616306/ft_scummvm.webm
[14:07] <grogbot> <eriktorbjorn> If I'm looking at the correct script, it does roomOps.shakeOn(), delayFrames(2), roomOps.shakeOff(). But the original a) moves the screen upwards instead of downwards, and b) gets in more shake frames than ScummVM does.
[14:08] <grogbot> <eientei> yeah, although I'm not sure if it's the scumm engine or the SDL backend at this point
[14:09] <grogbot> <eriktorbjorn> Well, it's ScummEngine::drawDirtySceenParts() that calls setShakePos() in the backend as far as I can tell.
[14:23] <grogbot> <eriktorbjorn> Seems to affect more than just Full Throttle, e.g. turning on the stereo in Day of the Tentacle.
[14:25] <logix> eriktorbjorn: I remember that shaking a lot for both the original interpreter and scummvm - but I never compared them directly and there surely were more than 10 years between me using the original interpreter and later using scummvm
[14:25] <logix> in DOTT that is
[14:26] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Given that the final NES version of Maniac Mansion runs under ScummVM (which is awesome; I've always wanted to play it with a mouse!), Is it possible to also play the "prototype" version, which was really the final before all of the censoring happened ?
[14:26] <grogbot> <eriktorbjorn> Another difference is that in the original, the mouse pointer shakes with the rest of the screen. (Though I guess in ScummVM it's just a drawing matter, so the hotspots don't shake with the rest of the screen? Perhaps they do in the original.)
[14:36] <Scummette> [scummvm] aquadran pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXCGE
[14:36] <Scummette> scummvm/master 318c40b aquadran: TINYGL: Added check for tglTexImage2D if texture is selected before
[14:38] <Scummette> [scummvm] aquadran pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXCnL
[14:38] <Scummette> scummvm/master 760699a aquadran: TINYGL: Added check if texture is selected to avoid textured triangle path
[14:57] <grogbot> <eriktorbjorn> I guess someone should file a bug report.
[15:24] <Scummette> [scummvm] aquadran pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXCbK
[15:24] <Scummette> scummvm/master 9114690 aquadran: STARK: Explicit enable/disable texture mode when needed
[15:28] <grogbot> <athrxx> Do we want to shake the mouse cursor like the original? That's not difficult to fix. The original kind of had no choice, since writing these offsets into the VGA registers would move everything on the screen...
[15:36] <eriktorbjorn> athrxx: I don't know. The direction and frequency are probably the main things.
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[16:32] <grogbot> <sev> No. We did not add the relevant data because there is no way to obtain this prototype legally
[16:33] <Scummette> [scummvm] neuromancer pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JXlTF
[16:33] <Scummette> scummvm/master 9e33332 neuromancer: HYPNO: refactored level handling to remove duplicated fields
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[17:09] <Scummette> [scummvm] benoit-pierre opened pull request #3501: XEEN: fix out-of-bounds accesses (master...xeen_fix_out-of-bounds_accesses_1) https://git.io/JXlKR
[17:20] <grogbot> <gordonfish> @sev Not quite sure what you mean. People have been running this in NES emulators for two decades now. As long as you're not distributing the game /ROM it self, there shouldn't be any issue allowing a 30 year old game to run.
[17:25] <grogbot> <sev> For you personally, I have no idea and honestly do kit even care: it is your business. But for the ScummVM Team that could be attributed as supporting piracy. Thus, no, we prefer to not mess with it and not put the team or individuals at risk
[17:28] <grogbot> <sev> @gordonfish
[17:39] <grogbot> <sev> Also, ScummVM is not an emulator. This, we have to add explicit code for this version
[17:52] <grogbot> <gordonfish> With respect, it is not supporting piracy any more than any emulator, which also has to have game specific provisions, such as NES mappers. Also, contrary to decades of misinformation by corporations, copying files in and of itself has never been an illegal act. Rather, distributing a work without permission from the rights holder is what violates copyright law.
[17:53] <grogbot> <gordonfish> I had to do some papers on that some time ago, so I can say that with high certainty.
[17:56] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Also, additional code on the ScummVM side should be minimal, as the prototype is largely the same as the retail release, it just contains what Nintendo wanted censored, which would be additional assets from the game data.
[18:12] <grogbot> <lephilousophe> you have to understand that if there is some piracy complaint, that's not something you will have to handle but it will be project administrators. They don't want to take any risk with that and, even if you don't agree with the reasons exposed by @sev, I hope you can accept this.
[18:17] <grogbot> <gordonfish> @lephilousophe I don't see how that could be a legitimate complaint though. It would be like complaining that zdoom supports yet another retail doom-engine game. Like the doom engine, the scumm engine was later opened up. And like the latter, it is on the user to provide the data to be run. I honestly don't see why it would be any different. And nevermind that what we are talking about is a prototype of a game released in 1989, so this
[18:17] <grogbot> also about preservation and history.
[18:19] <grogbot> <rootfather> Yes, a prototype that nobody can legally obtain.
[18:19] <grogbot> <gordonfish> I would never ask anyone to put them selves in a compromising position, ever. But this really feels far from that, that the worries are for naught.
[18:19] <grogbot> <rootfather> So no, it doesnt make sense to add it.
[18:22] <grogbot> <gordonfish> @rootfather It can be found on archive.org, which is long been considered legitimate. Also, as I had already mentioned, the act of copying (downloading is just copying over a network) is not what violates copyright law, distribution is where it comes in. Archive.org has a special exception from what I recall, so legally it should satisfy any concerns.
[18:23] <grogbot> <rootfather> I the US maybe
[18:23] <grogbot> <rootfather> In Europe for example archive.org is nothing but another warez site.
[18:24] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Not to get to technical but warez and sites that simply make the a file available are not the same thing, but that is a common mistake.
[18:25] <grogbot> <rootfather> It is a copyrighted game. And you cant have it legally. So no. No support for the prototype.
[18:25] <grogbot> <rootfather> Case closed.
[18:27] <grogbot> <rootfather> The thing is that you cant have an unreleased prototype. So having the game explicitly supported in ScummVM might look like we support piracy.
[18:27] <grogbot> <rootfather> ScummVM is not an emulator you can throw random code at.
[18:29] <Scummette> [scummvm] benoit-pierre opened pull request #3502: XEEN: fix out-of-bounds accesses (master...xeen_fix_out-of-bounds_accesses_2) https://git.io/JX8B2
[18:30] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Actually, the prototype is not really copyrighted. The way I remember that it works, is that had that version been accepted and released by nintendo, the copyright would apply to this version, but since it was passed and another version used for the RTM version, the prototype can be argued to be open. A lot of classic games as beta/prelease versions (such as Sonic 2, which had a huge following) not never had an issue of legality come up.
[18:30] <grogbot> <rootfather> Oh, I totally missed that LucasArts released the game assets as freeware.
[18:31] <grogbot> <rootfather> Really interesting.
[18:31] <grogbot> <gordonfish> @rootfather it is still modular, where you need to virtually insert a title, which needs to be procured separately, so the difference, while technically there, aren't observably evident.
[18:31] <grogbot> <rootfather> Again. There is no way you legally obtained this version.
[18:32] <grogbot> <rootfather> So our developers arent even able to play-test this version.
[18:32] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Why do you say that?
[18:32] <grogbot> <rootfather> Show me where this prototype was sold.
[18:32] <grogbot> <gordonfish> A title doesn't need to have been sold, that is a silly requirement.
[18:32] <grogbot> <rootfather> And no. Its not magically public domain because it got superseded by another RTM.
[18:33] <grogbot> <rootfather> Not discussing this any further. The version will not be accepted as @sev already said.
[18:34] <grogbot> <gordonfish> I didn't say it was PD, just open to use (as in no one will ever go after it) just like any other unreleased title, some of which have bene successfully sold as repro carts, even though there was no "legal release"
[18:34] <grogbot> <lephilousophe> I wonder in which country these rules apply. In Europe, as soon as someone creates some stuff there is a copyright on it and you can't do anything from it without author agreement.
[18:35] <grogbot> <lephilousophe> and as I already said, you are not the one taking risks here, so it's project owners decision not yours and the decision has been announced by the leader earlier. It is final.
[18:35] <grogbot> <rootfather> And stuff like this is EXACTLY what we are talking about. The fact that apparently nobody immediately hunts it down doesnt make it legally okay.
[18:35] <grogbot> <gordonfish> @lephilousophe It's about what version is officially considered to be the IP. An unreleased game is often compared to a rejected product that was left in a bin
[18:36] <grogbot> <lephilousophe> and yet, author has rights on it
[18:37] <grogbot> <gordonfish> felsqualle#9500 Which author? The last official owner was a magazine, one that I recall doesn't exist any more
[18:37] <grogbot> <rootfather> Hm. What about LucasArts (now Disney) owning the IP...
[18:37] <grogbot> <rootfather> The game assets...
[18:38] <grogbot> <rootfather> But this discussion is pointless.
[18:38] <grogbot> <gordonfish> The IP, but I'm talking about the cart from which the beta/prototype ROM was dumped from. That copy was known to be legit.
[18:38] <grogbot> <rootfather> BTW: Having the magazine disappear doesn't make it magically "open"
[18:39] <grogbot> <rootfather> Since rights can't disappear.
[18:39] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Put in perspective, we are talking bout a close to 35 year old beta of an 8-bit Nintendo game.
[18:40] <grogbot> <djsrv> corporate copyright lasts 120 years after creation for unpublished works
[18:40] <grogbot> <djsrv> 35 < 120
[18:40] <grogbot> <gordonfish> And if you re so concerned, why not just ask Disney/LucasArts "Hi, I would like to know if it would be alright if we put in support a beta version of a 30+ year old unreleased Maniac Mansion Nintendo game. We wont be distributing the game itself, just making it playable should anyone ever get a legitimate copy."
[18:41] <grogbot> <rootfather> I think we made pretty clear that it won't happen.
[18:41] <grogbot> <gordonfish> So you'd rather not even try?
[18:41] <grogbot> <rootfather> Nope.
[18:41] <grogbot> <rootfather> No support for unreleased prototypes.
[18:42] <grogbot> <rootfather> We rejected prototypes in the past as well, so this isn't the first time we have to deal with it.
[18:42] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Pardon my confusion, but why? Would it benifit everyone to support it for history sake, by doing due diligance by asking if they would have a problem with it?
[18:43] <grogbot> <gordonfish> @rootfather I can understand other prototypes, that weren't finished games, but for MM NES, it was the finished game, just uncensored. I've played through it and it really is great, a much closer match to the computer versions.
[18:43] <grogbot> <gordonfish> (But with the rockin' sound track.)
[18:43] <grogbot> <djsrv> attracting the attention of the litigious corporation who's responsible for modern copyright law isn't a great idea
[18:43] <grogbot> <gordonfish> I get that, but this really isn't something that is going to do that
[18:44] <grogbot> <eriktorbjorn> If anyone does manage to figure out how to get Disney to act, I'd like to know. I've been trying for months to get them to fix the broken version of Maniac Mansion that they are selling, and people have been asking them about the EGA version of Loom for years...
[18:45] <grogbot> <rootfather> The main issue is that even starting to tinker with prototypes and stuff might be problematic. And we can avoid many, many issues by simply only supporting versions that have been on a store shelf.
[18:45] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Something I really don't understand, is why it was ok to add support for the RTM NES MM in the first place, if it is a copyrighted game. I just want to be clear.
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[18:46] <grogbot> <rootfather> Because this versions was - at least to my knowledge - released officially. In case this wasn't an official release, we should indeed think about removing support for this version.
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[18:48] <grogbot> <lephilousophe> OK, @gordonfish here is a better idea: you fork ScummVM code, you add support to your prototype game, you distribute the code under a different name than ours and that's it. You are happy, we are.
[18:48] <grogbot> <lephilousophe> and when/if someone complains to you about it, it will be your problem not ours
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[18:51] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Yes because that makes so much sense... more so than just asking the rights holder if it would be ok. If they say yes, you have it in writing. But yeah lets just fork for possible archaic/historic title.
[18:52] <grogbot> <rootfather> Sounds like a good idea to me.
[18:54] <grogbot> <gordonfish> facepalms
[18:58] <grogbot> <gordonfish> (And maybe I'm missing something, but from what I'm seeing, SVM could already load it, but is prevented by extract_mm_nes not accepting the signature and refusing to extract the LFL files. I wonder if the tool was patched, would anything actually prevent SVM from running it.)
[19:00] <grogbot> <eriktorbjorn> I filed a bug report about SCUMM screen shaking, just so it won't be forgotten: https://bugs.scummvm.org/ticket/13065
[19:03] <grogbot> <athrxx> IIRC either OpenGL or SurfaceSDL even does shake the mouse cursor while the other mode doesn't. But I might be wrong. Haven't looked at that code for some time...
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[19:32] <grogbot> <somaen> Historically some companies have been even more lawyer-happy if the matter at hand is unreleased material. Why? Well because theres no way to have that without having actually broken into something.
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[19:33] <Scummette> [scummvm] sev- closed pull request #3497: DIRECTOR: handle macbinary audio streams (master...director_handle_macbinary_audio) https://git.io/JXOGF
[19:33] <Scummette> [scummvm] sev- pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JX85y
[19:33] <Scummette> scummvm/master 753c1c2 mistydemeo: DIRECTOR: handle macbinary audio streams
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[20:15] <grogbot> <gordonfish> @somaen Good point, though in this particular case, this is what was sent to magazines. It's not actually a beta or prototype per-se, it's the final before the censoring happened, which is closer to the computer versions.
[20:17] <grogbot> <somaen> So this particular copy was distributed, but if I understand you correctly, it was only distributed as a review-copy, which means that it was not intended for further spreading, and thus some magazine has had to break the license it was posted to them under.
[20:17] <grogbot> <somaen> Further copies from that are not any more legitimate than the initially "leaked" copy.
[20:18] <grogbot> <somaen> If however this version had been legitimately distributed as a magazine cover disk (or equivalent), then you would have an argument for supporting it.
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[20:20] <grogbot> <somaen> As it stands, we're not willing to spend any time to support this, but as was mentioned above, our license fully allows you to take our code and add whatever support you want, we just won't accept any such patches coming back for this particular release.
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[20:28] <grogbot> <Carnivol> Maybe try contacting someone like Mike Mika (from Digital Eclipse). If anyone would know whom to ping, it'd probably be him. He seems to be a pretty reachable/approachable guy, and Digital Eclipse has done work on several Disney license game re-releases.
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[20:42] <grogbot> <Retrodude> really though, it doesn't seem like Disney even cares about anything LucasArts that's not Star Wars anymore, but I'm sure they WILL go full litigation on anyone who violates their copyright even on those
[20:43] <grogbot> <Retrodude> i still think them putting the FM-Towns version of Zak McKracken was a total fluke, considering they haven't listened to fans at all and given us literally any version of Loom that isn'
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[20:59] <Scummette> [scummvm] neuromancer pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/JX4ZS
[20:59] <Scummette> scummvm/master df6739b neuromancer: HYPNO: removed debug prints in the parsers
[20:59] <Scummette> scummvm/master 974575f neuromancer: HYPNO: fixed deadlock issue in conversations and support for default option
[21:04] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Yeah I can see them going after people who actually violate copyright, but there is nothing about allowing that version of run that would do that. No game data is being distributed.
[21:07] <grogbot> <lephilousophe> please stop.
[21:08] <grogbot> <lephilousophe> you have made your point, the team made its. There is a disagreement here, we have the final word on this. You know what to do if you want the support.
[21:09] <grogbot> <lephilousophe> as @rootfather said more than 2 hours ago case closed
[21:09] <logix> gordonfish: good, so go and fork scummvm, incorporate the patch and put it up on your webpage - it's not a big deal technicall, and unlike the scumm folks you seem to be willing to take the legal risk (or, from your point of view, not-risk), I don't know what this whole discussion is about...
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[21:17] <grogbot> <gordonfish> I just don't see what real risk there is. Not when people have been creating entire emulators that can run this game and others without any sort of legal repercussions. If this was really the problem it's being made out to be, I really don't know how we'd have any worth while emulators or VMs of older systems, pretty much all of which can run copyrighted software, that the user has to supply, not the emu/VM authors.
[21:19] <logix> please just go and fork it and host it, that way everybody is happy
[21:42] <grogbot> <somaen> Look, this is simple, we've said what we want to do, it's our spare time that gets used to do this, so if we wanted to ban games that used too much blue in their title, then it would still be our prerogative (as a team of volunteers) to do so, just like it is yours to fork it. There is nothing else to be said on this matter.
[21:54] <grogbot> <gordonfish> It doesn't have to be your spare time. Other people (like my self for instance) could be willing to submit a patch. And if I'm right, that patch wouldn't be with SVM itself but extract_mm_nes. I got curious and already made some headway by comparing the two PRGs. I already have the "room/script resource" and "graphics resource" phase done. Currently comparing sound resources. It's mainly just a handful of differing offsets thus far.
[21:55] <grogbot> <rootfather> Just no.
[21:55] <grogbot> <rootfather> It won't land in ScummVM.
[21:55] <grogbot> <rootfather> Now matter what you do.
[21:55] <grogbot> <somaen> Unless you can give us a notarized letter from Bob Chapek saying it's OK.
[21:55] <grogbot> <somaen> In which case, wow.
[21:56] <grogbot> <somaen> </topic>
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[22:40] <Scummette> [scummvm] dreammaster closed pull request #3501: XEEN: fix out-of-bounds accesses (master...xeen_fix_out-of-bounds_accesses_1) https://git.io/JXlKR
[22:40] <Scummette> [scummvm] dreammaster pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JX4Po
[22:40] <Scummette> scummvm/master 2fbd26d benoit-pierre: XEEN: fix out-of-bounds accesses
[22:41] <Scummette> [scummvm] dreammaster pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JX4PH
[22:41] <Scummette> scummvm/master 2eaee92 dreammaster: XEEN: Fix end address of spells grid fill
[22:42] <Scummette> [scummvm] dreammaster pushed 2 new commits to branch-2-5: https://git.io/JX4Xt
[22:42] <Scummette> scummvm/branch-2-5 8749a25 benoit-pierre: XEEN: fix out-of-bounds accesses
[22:42] <Scummette> scummvm/branch-2-5 30147ee dreammaster: XEEN: Fix end address of spells grid fill
[22:50] <grogbot> <eientei> Cheers for that, was gonna do it when I woke up... (Which is just now :v)
[22:53] <Scummette> [scummvm] dreammaster closed pull request #3502: XEEN: fix out-of-bounds accesses (master...xeen_fix_out-of-bounds_accesses_2) https://git.io/JX8B2
[22:53] <Scummette> [scummvm] dreammaster pushed 1 new commits to master: https://git.io/JX4DT
[22:53] <Scummette> scummvm/master a64eff9 benoit-pierre: XEEN: fix out-of-bounds accesses
[22:53] <Scummette> [scummvm] dreammaster pushed 1 new commits to branch-2-5: https://git.io/JX4D3
[22:53] <Scummette> scummvm/branch-2-5 eab9052 benoit-pierre: XEEN: fix out-of-bounds accesses
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[23:21] <grogbot> <gordonfish> Just wanting to understand, exactly what permission would be sought from Bob Chapek? SVM deals with the engine side of things. It doesn't come bundled with any game data. The scumm engine itself is free to use, source port, et al. So to me it's comparable to things like zdoom, zquake, etc, where the engine is open, but source ports do not provide the actual game data, that falls on the user.
[23:22] <grogbot> <gordonfish> So if the engine is open, what exactly would be asked of someone like Bob Chapek?
[23:23] <grogbot> <DreamMaster> It's not about ScummVM, it's about the game. Now please, drop the matter. This is now your third warning to do so.
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[23:24] <grogbot> <gordonfish> About the game in what way? SVM doesn't provide any game.
[23:24] <grogbot> <gordonfish> I'm just trying to understand where the issue is.
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[23:25] <grogbot> <DreamMaster> The issues, as you say, has already been explained thoroughly earlier in the day.
[23:52] <logix> gordonfish: the issue isn't about distribution of copyrighted material as such, it's about any kind of association with material that legally should not be available to anybody except for a *very* small circle to begin with
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