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[00:52] <GitHub108> [scummvm] dreammaster pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6L1T
[00:52] <GitHub108> scummvm/master 9f316a5 Paul Gilbert: GRAPHICS: Fix MSVC project generation
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[01:38] <snover> fuzzie: fyi, 87818fe63ac851e89513c2fe49c9646d64566b31 breaks my build because DATA_PATH is not defined. theres an ifdef guard in sdl.cpp but not in posix.cpp.
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[01:43] <snover> you could also tell me that my build environment is invalid :)
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[01:47] <GitHub3> [scummvm] dreammaster pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6LS1
[01:47] <GitHub3> scummvm/master 3fda4f0 Paul Gilbert: TITANIC: Add CSound sound loading methods
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[02:26] <GitHub137> [scummvm] dreammaster pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6LHS
[02:26] <GitHub137> scummvm/master c34af39 Paul Gilbert: TITANIC: Correct sound manager methods to return existing WaveFile class
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[06:03] <blorente> Morning
[06:16] <Begasus> morning
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[07:10] <fuzzie> let me respond to snover via e-mail
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[07:38] <GitHub144> [scummvm] Tkachov pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6tTL
[07:38] <GitHub144> scummvm/master 7a89caa Alexander Tkachev: COMMON: Add WriteStream::pos()...
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[08:17] <GitHub193> [scummvm] Tkachov pushed 2 new commits to master: https://git.io/v6tLO
[08:17] <GitHub193> scummvm/master f58abd9 Alexander Tkachev: COMMON: Update GZipWriteStream::pos()...
[08:17] <GitHub193> scummvm/master ef631c9 Alexander Tkachev: WAGE: Update saves format...
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[09:27] <ScummBot> Port build status changed with 7a89caac: Failure: master-n64
[09:28] <m_kiewitz> noes
[09:37] Nick change: ChrisKeys_ -> ChrisKeys
[10:02] <ScummBot> Port build status changed with 7a89caac: Failure: master-dc-serial
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[10:36] <ScummBot> Port build status changed with 7a89caac: Failure: master-dc
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[10:48] <GitHub64> [scummvm] Tkachov pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6tEZ
[10:48] <GitHub64> scummvm/master 2597be2 Alexander Tkachev: BACKENDS: Fix DC's OutVMSave to have pos()
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[10:49] <GitHub165> [scummvm] sev- pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6tEW
[10:49] <GitHub165> scummvm/master eedd128 Eugene Sandulenko: N64: Fix build adter WriteStream::pos() addition
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[10:49] <GitHub167> [scummvm] sev- pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6tEE
[10:49] <GitHub167> scummvm/master d111b16 Eugene Sandulenko: N64: Fix warning
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[11:05] <GitHub10> [scummvm] sev- pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6tu9
[11:05] <GitHub10> scummvm/master a4d39b2 Eugene Sandulenko: N64: Added pos() method to another save class
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[11:08] <GitHub161> [scummvm] sev- pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6tze
[11:08] <GitHub161> scummvm/master cb195a8 Eugene Sandulenko: DC: Fix compilation
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[11:08] <ScummBot> Port build status changed with a4d39b23: Success: master-n64
[11:08] <m_kiewitz> horray _sev
[11:09] <_sev> not yet
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[11:16] <_sev> now horray
[11:22] <ScummBot> Port build status changed with cb195a81: Success: master-dc-serial, master-dc. Nice work, all ports built fine now
[11:22] <_sev> now it is time to merge Lingo
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[11:23] <GitHub27> [scummvm] sev- closed pull request #787: DIRECTOR: New engine (master...director) https://git.io/vKP4D
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[11:23] <GitHub145> [scummvm] sev- pushed 354 new commits to master: https://git.io/v6tg3
[11:23] <GitHub145> scummvm/master a243b5c Matthew Hoops: DIRECTOR: Add engine skeleton
[11:23] <GitHub145> scummvm/master 8c252aa Matthew Hoops: DIRECTOR: Add basic resource code
[11:23] <GitHub145> scummvm/master 50c52ab Matthew Hoops: DIRECTOR: Fix RIFX files inside of EXE's
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[11:36] <_sev> wow
[11:36] <_sev> everything is failed
[11:38] <m_kiewitz> wait, Matthew Hoops? clone?
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[11:39] <GitHub185> [scummvm] sev- pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6t2D
[11:39] <GitHub185> scummvm/master e0a9d96 Eugene Sandulenko: DIRECTOR: Put flex/bison as separate target, so general compilation is not affected
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[11:39] <_sev> yes, it started by him couple years ago
[11:39] <m_kiewitz> i thought he came back :(
[11:41] <_sev> judging by his commits he had burn the bridges
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[11:43] <ScummBot> Port build status changed with 902d49ce: Failure: master-wii, master-psp, master-gamecube, master-debian-x86_64, master-debian-x86-clang, master-ios7, master-mingw-w64-cplusplus11, master-webos, master-debian-x86-nullbackend, master-dingux, master-ps2, master-ps3, master-gp2xwiz, master-gcw0, master-ios, master-ouya, master-osx_intel, master-caanoo, master-
[11:43] <ScummBot> android_x86, master-motoezx, master
[11:43] <ScummBot> -android_arm, master-android_mips, master-dc-serial, master-gp2x, master-amigaos4, master-mingw-w32, master-openpandora, master-mingw-w64, master-ds, master-dc, master-debian-x86, master-motomagx, master-wince
[11:43] <m_kiewitz> noooooo
[11:43] <_sev> m_kiewitz: read above
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[11:44] <salty-horse> many of the auto-posts to twitter are cut off and could be split into a second tweet or written manually. are they cross-posted from facebook?
[11:53] <_sev> they go by ifttt.com
[11:53] <_sev> and the problem is not with them
[11:54] <_sev> it is facebook as playing bad with me last 2 times
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[12:17] <GitHub50> [scummvm] sev- pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6toe
[12:17] <GitHub50> scummvm/master 4551a25 Eugene Sandulenko: DIRECTOR: Lingo: Fix PS2 compilation
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[12:24] <salty-horse> anyone wants to review https://github.com/scummvm/scummvm/pull/790 ?
[12:31] <_sev> I wanted, but you told 'please hold off', and never released it from the hold
[12:32] <salty-horse> oops. I assumed it's released by the next comment :P
[12:32] <salty-horse> I mean, next push
[12:32] <salty-horse> THERE
[12:33] <salty-horse> it's as if the hold never existed, and you don't get an email about it, but it's ok to do things dirty since we're in chat
[12:34] <_sev> heh, ok
[12:35] <_sev> I wonder why Travis is not building it
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[12:45] <ScummBot> Port build status changed with e0a9d969: Success: master-wii, master-psp, master-gamecube, master-debian-x86_64, master-debian-x86-clang, master-ios7, master-mingw-w64-cplusplus11, master-webos, master-debian-x86-nullbackend, master-dingux, master-ps3, master-gp2xwiz, master-gcw0, master-ios, master-ouya, master-osx_intel, master-caanoo, master-android_x86,
[12:45] <ScummBot> master-motoezx, master-android_arm
[12:45] <ScummBot> , master-android_mips, master-dc-serial, master-gp2x, master-amigaos4, master-mingw-w32, master-openpandora, master-mingw-w64, master-ds, master-dc, master-debian-x86, master-motomagx
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[12:50] <GitHub139> [scummvm] sev- pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6tiw
[12:50] <GitHub139> scummvm/master e7cc065 Eugene Sandulenko: DIRECTOR: Lingo: Fix WinCE compilation....
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[13:00] <ScummBot> Port build status changed with 4551a254: Success: master-ps2
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[13:53] <GitHub131> [scummvm] sev- pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6t5l
[13:53] <GitHub131> scummvm/master 266e8e6 Eugene Sandulenko: DIRECTOR: Lingo: Add prefix 'v' to all Symbol types....
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[13:53] <t0by> Yay Lingo
[14:02] <_sev> grrr. WinCE toolchain is extremely ancient
[14:03] <_sev> I think it is time to kill it
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[14:03] <t0by> hey snover
[14:08] <snover> hey t0by.
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[14:22] <GitHub3> [scummvm] fuzzie pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6tNx
[14:22] <GitHub3> scummvm/master 13d0ec9 Alyssa Milburn: POSIX: Add #ifdef guards for DATA_PATH....
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[14:48] <m_kiewitz> new HTTPS attack http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/08/new-attack-steals-ssns-e-mail-addresses-and-more-from-https-pages/
[14:53] <salty-horse> ok, revert ScummVM to HTTP
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[14:53] <GitHub60> [scummvm] csnover pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6tjN
[14:53] <GitHub60> scummvm/master 12d1af6 Colin Snover: SCI32: Add QFG4 Windows signature
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[15:48] <rootfather> hi folks
[15:48] <rootfather> wohoo, "Director's Merge"
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[16:29] <m_kiewitz> wow, a Japanese RPG localized by Sierra called Zeliard
[16:29] <m_kiewitz> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7OC2mXE1do
[16:29] <t0by> Strangerke would have a blast with this
[16:30] <t0by> m_kiewitz, why did the leaking program get a large phone bill?
[16:30] <m_kiewitz> huh?
[16:30] <t0by> no free calls.
[16:30] <t0by> har har har.
[16:30] <m_kiewitz> :/
[16:31] <t0by> "Sierra Does Japan"
[16:32] <m_kiewitz> he played larry 5 right before this
[16:32] <m_kiewitz> using ScummVM even :P
[16:32] <m_kiewitz> and that made me notice a graphical bug :P
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[16:42] <WooShell> meow =^.^=
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[17:33] <t0by> Q: Anybody in here uses Emacs as his/her/its C++ IDE?
[17:34] <t0by> Particularly, semantic?
[17:34] <t0by> If so, how do you make it work for your scummvm tree, particularly namespaces?
[17:35] <t0by> My configuration seems not to be working across namespaces
[17:36] <salty-horse> t0by, singular they!
[17:37] <t0by> salty-horse, I'm sorry?
[17:38] <salty-horse> use singular they instead of his/her/its :P
[17:38] <salty-horse> i.e. "their"
[17:38] <t0by> "as their C++ IDE"?
[17:38] <t0by> Even if they are not a... swarm?
[17:38] <salty-horse> yes. it's valid.
[17:39] <t0by> English is weird.
[17:39] <t0by> Thaks.
[17:39] <t0by> *Thanks.
[17:39] <t0by> In my language we have a single word that goes with everything for that, under no assumptions of gender or number :)
[17:39] <t0by> brb
[17:41] <salty-horse> some languages are superior to others :)
[17:41] <salty-horse> (in some aspects)
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[19:38] <_sev> t0by: I was using emacs for many years as my primary IDE
[19:40] <_sev> t0by: and when I tired of transferring it to new machines, I did this: http://wiki.scummvm.org/index.php/Code_Formatting_Conventions#Emacs_style
[19:46] <t0by> _sev, it's in my .emacs :)
[19:46] <_sev> and with these settings it worked out of the box
[19:47] <t0by> now I know who to thanks
[19:47] <t0by> *thank
[19:47] <t0by> so thanks
[19:47] <t0by> _sev, eh, actually my emacs24 gets confused with namespaces
[19:47] <_sev> you are welcome
[19:47] <_sev> well, then they changed it
[19:47] <t0by> I don't think it's a parsing problem
[19:47] Action: _sev launches aquamacs to check
[19:47] <t0by> But I haven't spent more than 5 minutes on it
[19:48] <t0by> Don't bother
[19:48] <t0by> In case somebody has a working .emacsrc from a recent emacs, though, or has faced the same problem...
[19:48] <_sev> okay, it needs an update
[19:48] <_sev> now it is based on emacs24
[19:48] <_sev> so, getting the one which is on emacs25
[19:49] <t0by> uh, i am on 24
[19:51] <wanwan> say, if game allows to select between different sound devices or graphic modes, which one should i stick with when implementing an engine?
[19:52] <_sev> t0by: indeed, they changed the behavior :/
[19:53] <somaen> wanwan: All of them?
[19:53] <wanwan> btw, engine template code in wiki has well-known formating problem
[19:53] <t0by> wanwan, I suppose you would use the osystem and let that be a problem of the poor backend developers :)
[19:53] <somaen> I assume he talks about i.e. games that have EGA and VGA assets?
[19:54] <wanwan> somaen: yes, like that. ega/vga, adlib/soundblaster, etc
[19:54] <t0by> Uh, ah.
[19:54] <somaen> Is there an in-game choice or a pre-launch choice?
[19:54] <wanwan> all originally selectable not from the game itself, but external setup utility
[19:54] <somaen> Separate data files?
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[19:55] <wanwan> yeah, different music files for various soundcards
[19:55] <wanwan> like, general midi, mt32 and such
[19:55] <somaen> Well, there's precedence for this in Monkey Island 1 IIRC
[19:55] <wanwan> same for graphics assets
[19:55] <somaen> (MT32 data was an addon)
[19:56] <somaen> ScummVM has config options for some of that from the launcher
[19:56] <_sev> wanwan: I fixed the page
[19:56] <somaen> IIRC, there's similar options for EGA/VGA
[19:56] <wanwan> _sev: cool!
[19:57] <_sev> wanwan: we prefer to provide as many options as possible, the best is to give all of them
[19:57] <somaen> Quite a few of the SCUMM-games have EGA/VGA choices in-game
[19:57] <somaen> possibly also CGA
[19:57] <_sev> wanwan: and we have code for the most widespread ones, and even some exotics. So for the engine authors it is in many cases just to plug in the relevant sound emulator
[19:57] <wanwan> well, that adds up more work obviously... which one is preferred?
[19:57] <_sev> not only CGA
[19:57] <somaen> All of them
[19:58] <_sev> there are couple of games where I added Hercules graphics :)
[19:58] <somaen> But start of with the best graphics, and the best non-mt32 sound
[19:58] <somaen> (Since the MT32 stuff requires soundfonts iirc)
[19:58] <_sev> somaen: completely wrong
[19:59] <somaen> Oh, my bad
[19:59] <somaen> I thought it required ROMs
[19:59] <_sev> somaen: MT32 is sound generation, has nothing common with soundfonts which are pre-generated
[19:59] <_sev> yes, it requires ROMs
[19:59] <somaen> My bad then.
[19:59] <_sev> as I know, the project on emulating the actual hardware is dead
[19:59] <_sev> munt is a simulation
[20:00] <_sev> LordNightmare was trying to work on executing the ROM contents, but id did not go far
[20:00] <_sev> which is a pity. I was hoping that MAME gets the device emulated some day
[20:01] <somaen> wanwan: What audio options are there?
[20:05] <t0by> Funnily, IIRC the MT32 is not that different from a D50, and I know for a fact that Roland has a software emulator of the D50 somewhere.
[20:05] <t0by> (Because there was a D50 emulator ROM for the V-Synth)
[20:05] <wanwan> somaen: one game offers adlib/soundblaster (uses FM music on both), another one adlib/sb/mt32/adlib gold
[20:06] <wanwan> and different files for adlib, mt32 and sb, as far as i can see
[20:06] <t0by> Hu.
[20:06] <t0by> http://dsynkant.sourceforge.net/
[20:06] <t0by> There is a D50 emulator under semi-active development
[20:06] <t0by> (latest commit late 2015)
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[20:43] <wanwan> interesting Japanese retro game development tidbits http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/JohnSzczepaniak/20160726/277925/
[20:45] <wanwan> "i became game programmer after i reverse-engineered some game", hehe
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[21:01] <GitHub126> [scummvm] sev- pushed 4 new commits to master: https://git.io/v6qh0
[21:01] <GitHub126> scummvm/master 7ec2e7b Eugene Sandulenko: DIRECTOR: Lingo: Added 'alert' and 'beep' function stubs
[21:01] <GitHub126> scummvm/master 415cefd Eugene Sandulenko: DIRECTOR: Lingo: Added stubs for 'closeDA', 'closeResFile' and 'closeXlib'
[21:01] <GitHub126> scummvm/master 8883a03 Eugene Sandulenko: DIRECTOR: Lingo: Simplified code generation for constants
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[21:03] <t0by> wanwan: sweet
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[21:18] <GitHub183> [scummvm] sev- pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v6mvw
[21:18] <GitHub183> scummvm/master 7a79eec Eugene Sandulenko: DIRECTOR: Fix warnings
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[21:24] <somaen> wanwan: We generally offer selections for at least adlib/sb/mt32, not sure if we differentiate for adlib gold
[21:25] <wanwan> and what about ega/vga/mono graphics?
[21:26] <somaen> mono?
[21:26] <somaen> Any specific monochrome mode?
[21:26] <wanwan> there's a choice to play the game in monochrome mode
[21:26] <_sev> wanwan: Hercules, as I mentioned
[21:26] <wanwan> not sure who is sane mind would want that, though
[21:27] <snover> as though anyone here is of sane mind ;)
[21:27] <somaen> Well, our dropdown offers Hercules {Green, Amber}, CGA, EGA, VGA, Amiga, FM-Towns, PC9821 ({256,16} Colors)
[21:28] <_sev> but the rendering itself is fully on the engine
[21:28] <somaen> Sure, but that boils down to what you wish to expose, no?
[21:28] <somaen> I.e. if you want to respect that EGA choice properly by using the EGA assets
[21:28] <_sev> yes, kind of
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[21:29] <_sev> with GUIO now it is possible to restrict those values
[21:29] <_sev> but only few engines added support for those
[21:30] <somaen> In practice, if you only want to implement one (for now), go for VGA, unless somehow the EGA is better, or more well known.
[21:30] <wanwan> that's what i'm actually planning to do
[21:30] <somaen> EGA only?
[21:30] <wanwan> no, vga only for now
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[21:31] <somaen> Just keep in mind that you (or someone else) might want to implement the others later when you do implementation assumptions
[21:31] <wanwan> as far as i remember, ega has some crazy paging stuff i really don't want mess with
[21:31] <wanwan> *want to
[21:32] <somaen> Well, write to backend is the same, only the available colours differ
[21:32] <somaen> Data files is of course an entirely different thing
[21:32] <wanwan> yes, but game assets may be in ega-specific format
[21:32] <somaen> Fair enough
[21:33] <snover> just render the vga version with a ega pixel shader. Problem Solved. :~)
[21:33] <somaen> My point was mostly that you probably want to avoid hard coding assumptions about the format in a way that's hard to rework later
[21:33] <wanwan> haha
[21:33] <wanwan> game development back then must be really challenging
[21:34] <somaen> I.e. Wintermute is heavily coded around an assumption about full 32 bit / 24 bit colour
[21:34] <wanwan> when you have like 5 different platforms each with it's own cpu/graphics/sound hardware and your game is written in assembly language
[21:34] <somaen> Well, these days you just pick Unreal 3 or Unity of the shelf for the backend parts
[21:35] <somaen> (when designing new games)
[21:35] <somaen> Well, depends on how code-driven your game is.
[21:36] <somaen> A fair amount of the time might be spent on game design / asset creation
[21:37] <somaen> Then you have various takes on the porting issues too, Myst for instance was basically rewritten from scratch for each port.
[21:39] <m_kiewitz> somaen: it's quite strange that Unreal Engine 3 games are typically extremely buggy, and all sorts of old games don't really have that many bugs if any bugs at all
[21:39] <wanwan> it might be not that big issue for adventure games, but something more action-oriented, like a platformer or a fighting game?
[21:39] <somaen> Can put a generic engine behind those too
[21:40] <somaen> But... then it boils down to how heavily your game pushes sprite-limits etc.
[21:40] <m_kiewitz> well, SCI and AGI and so on are engines too. But games worked (well the later Sierra games were quite buggy too)
[21:40] <m_kiewitz> it seems companies are really saving on QA and development time nowadays
[21:41] <somaen> Well, the time frame you need to be profitable in is shorter too
[21:41] <snover> when you can ship patches for free over the internet, instead of having to mail floppies for free to your customers, one would anticipate cut corners in QA.
[21:41] <snover> er, floppies at cost
[21:41] <m_kiewitz> yes, that's the problem
[21:41] <m_kiewitz> well especially a huge problem on so called consoles too
[21:41] <m_kiewitz> patches should fix rare oversights, and not basically the whole game
[21:42] <somaen> You mean the somewhat cheaper gaming PCs with controllers?
[21:42] <wanwan> i read a story somewhere about certain n64 (if i'm not mistaken) game, where developers unable to fix some mysterious crashes and to avoid them they just bundled game with an extra memory pack for the console itself. and that magically solved the problem
[21:42] <m_kiewitz> but sure, why bother when customers still buy those day 1 and cry a bit but then buy the successor again day
[21:42] <m_kiewitz> 1
[21:42] <m_kiewitz> wanwan: i think that was a RARE game
[21:42] <wanwan> yeah, i believe it was Conker
[21:43] <snover> http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/05/donkey_kong_64_required_expansion_pak_to_prevent_game_breaking_bug
[21:43] <m_kiewitz> Donkey Kong 64?
[21:43] <m_kiewitz> HA
[21:43] <m_kiewitz> :P
[21:43] <wanwan> oh, well :)
[21:43] <m_kiewitz> but well, nowdays they would have shipped it anyway and then applied a patch or even not patch it at all, because why bother
[21:43] <m_kiewitz> stupid customers will still buy it
[21:43] <wanwan> nowdays you have to download 20gb patches :>
[21:44] <somaen> Oh, not only that
[21:44] <m_kiewitz> wasn't the "patch" of one of the latest game larger than the actual game itself?
[21:44] <somaen> My consoles require me to update the OS on them at arbitrary times before allowing me to play
[21:44] <m_kiewitz> i think the latest tony hawk pro skater game was a rush job and they basically put nothing on the disc and the actual game came via patch lol
[21:45] <m_kiewitz> well, I'm Nintendo only this generation, because I got sick of that last generation w/ PS3
[21:45] <m_kiewitz> and except for 3rd party games, that works really well. They still care about software quality
[21:45] <m_kiewitz> I mean they released a HUGE and I mean HUGE open world RPG called Xenoblade Chronicles X, and it got one single tiny patch and that was it
[21:45] <m_kiewitz> now for comparison we will look at the competition ... Bethesda *cough*
[21:46] <somaen> My PS3 requires me to do all those updates via USB
[21:47] <somaen> After I upgraded the HDD in it, OTA-updates fail to the point of semi-bricking it
[21:47] <wanwan> isn't one of their game (Skyrim?) has some really bad memory leaking issue and they even give up fixing it?
[21:48] <m_kiewitz> Skyrim on PS3 is the first game that had 0 fps at some points
[21:48] <m_kiewitz> yeah zero frames per second
[21:48] <m_kiewitz> their engine is horribly designed and wasn't meant for consoles
[21:48] <m_kiewitz> and they had those issues since fallout 3
[21:48] <somaen> Well, sub 1 I hope
[21:48] <m_kiewitz> and it got worse and worse. And they said they would use a new engine. And they lied. And the problems got worse with Fallout New Vegas
[21:49] <m_kiewitz> and Skyrim was even worse than that
[21:49] <somaen> FNV is the same engine as FO3
[21:49] <m_kiewitz> I think they somewhat fixed it. I haven't touched that game, I only bought the Limited Edition of Skyrim to get the artbook + the dragon
[21:49] <m_kiewitz> lol, it seems in the end they changed it so that items would reset after a few days in game and not after months or not at all
[21:50] <somaen> Played it a fair amount on PC, and a bit on PS3, shooters in general are not something I prefer consoles for
[21:50] <m_kiewitz> Fallout 3 + New Vegas are not really shooters in the classic sense. There is VATS, which is basically some sort of auto-aim and auto-shoot
[21:50] <m_kiewitz> and it's more of a RPG
[21:50] <somaen> Yeah, they balance it fairly well
[21:51] <somaen> VATS has its limits though
[21:51] <m_kiewitz> without VATS the game would be basically unplayable lol
[21:51] <wanwan> that actually reminds me something absolutely hilarious http://kotaku.com/someone-took-all-the-items-from-a-skyrim-town-1644711264
[21:51] <somaen> Fallout 4 is... worse in that regard
[21:51] <m_kiewitz> oh yeah, fallout 4 is basically fallout 3 but with a town editor. Wait, it's a dumbed down fallout 3
[21:51] <m_kiewitz> fallout 3 had some many dialog options. Fallout 4 has literally 4. All the time. Including "Sarcastic" whatever that means
[21:52] <somaen> Well, the levelling system is interesting, but the general tone of the game is off
[21:52] <m_kiewitz> Fallout New Vegas was well designed, I mean the game itself. The engine is crap. But I loved that the game world itself made sense
[21:52] <somaen> I thought it felt less complete than FO3
[21:53] <somaen> Then again, I'm not much to judge by, as someone that prefers MI1 to MI2
[21:53] <m_kiewitz> yeah, I'm not really into those games. I bought them when they were cheap and only when all DLC and patches and everything were on disc.
[21:53] <somaen> Fallout 2 is among my favourites
[21:54] <m_kiewitz> same with Skyrim. I bought the LE when it was really cheap. And the complete edition when it was 11 pounds or so
[21:54] <t0by> Um
[21:54] <t0by> sorry, is wanwan by any chance a gsoc student?
[21:54] <m_kiewitz> yeah, Fallout 3 was already basically a dumbed down Fallout 2 :P
[21:54] <m_kiewitz> but in 3D....in space...
[21:54] <somaen> Yeah, but it at least tried to be close in tone.
[21:54] <m_kiewitz> yes
[21:54] <somaen> Fallout 2 is dark
[21:54] <m_kiewitz> I liked that there were so many options too, I mean relatively speaking
[21:55] <somaen> Fallout 4 is fun, but it is "mass-market-appeal"-dark
[21:55] <m_kiewitz> but then the original ending of Fallout 3 was basically a joke
[21:55] <m_kiewitz> or even the last "boss" lol
[21:55] <t0by> Ah, the good old Marvel-dark instead of obscure-black-metal-dark
[21:55] <m_kiewitz> I have no idea what they were thinking
[21:56] <somaen> As someone that completed FFX twice, end-bosses... meh.
[21:56] <somaen> Post-end-game is where everything is at
[21:57] <wanwan> t0by: no, i'm not. why?
[21:57] <t0by> nevermind
[21:58] <m_kiewitz> well that's the joke. Originally there was no post game
[21:58] <m_kiewitz> the game just ended
[21:58] <m_kiewitz> with a tiny bit of narration and then it was over. It was basically as bad as the Mass effect 3 ending lol
[21:58] <m_kiewitz> i mean a 100% let down
[21:58] <somaen> That's why you avoid the end-sequence for as long as you can
[21:59] <somaen> The lack of "how the world turned out because of your actions" was jarring though
[21:59] <m_kiewitz> well not anymore, but back then no one knew that they had done this
[21:59] <m_kiewitz> yes
[21:59] <m_kiewitz> oh so you decided this way, then I guess the explosions will be purple lol
[22:00] <somaen> t0by: There's a difference between "happy go lucky"-dark, and Vetinari-dark
[22:00] <somaen> (the insignia-colour, not the character)
[22:00] <t0by> Wait, what is happy-go-lucky-dark?
[22:01] <somaen> Dark stuff you'd let your sunday-school going 8 year-old play
[22:01] <t0by> (I get the idea, but you know, curious)
[22:01] <t0by> ah wait, you don't mean merry-go-round-dark, right?
[22:01] <t0by> aka emo-kid-from-2008-dark
[22:01] <somaen> Something like that, yes.
[22:02] <somaen> thewhitechamber is not that kind of dark
[22:02] <somaen> In general, you wouldn't see blockbuster-movies going that kind of dark for instance.
[22:03] <somaen> Oh, I know
[22:03] <somaen> You know Peter Jackson's early stuff?
[22:04] <somaen> Bad Taste / Brain Dead, that's happy-go-lucky-dark
[22:05] <m_kiewitz> that was crazy, but props for the great effects (no computer generated stuff)
[22:05] <m_kiewitz> kinda funny how the director of Brain Dead got to create the Lord of the Rings movies.
[22:06] Action: t0by needs to watch Jackson's early stuff sometime
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[22:06] Action: t0by also needs to fix the white chamber some time
[22:06] <somaen> Expect there to be literally no relation between the LoTR and his early work
[22:07] <somaen> What's borked there?
[22:08] <somaen> t0by: IIRC the game is completable at least
[22:09] <t0by> stuff, IIRC, unless they have all been fixed in the meanwhile
[22:09] <t0by> btw thanks for taking a look at my prs last month
[22:09] <t0by> when I have a free second I'll address your comments
[22:10] <t0by> sorry for taking so long but it's a... weird couple of months
[22:10] <somaen> Sure, np
[22:10] <somaen> Oh, perhaps that robot and the key-mapping is borked
[22:11] <t0by> I can't honestly remember and I'm about to go to sleep, so I won't open the bug tracker and find myself sucked in :)
[22:11] <somaen> Good idea
[22:11] <somaen> Do feel free to have a look at any open bugs
[22:11] <snover> or all the open bugs
[22:12] <snover> if you could just come in over the weekend to work on those, that would be great
[22:12] <m_kiewitz> t0by: you haven't seen "The Frighteners"?
[22:12] <t0by> nopes
[22:20] <m_kiewitz> you should.
[22:21] <m_kiewitz> Michael J. Fox
[22:29] <t0by> nite people
[22:29] <t0by> o/
[22:30] <snover> \o
[22:32] <snover> oh sierra. what the heck did you do to the renderer in kq7 1.51.
[22:33] <snover> the intro video renders with a white background, although the background is a pic filled with byte 0
[22:34] <snover> but palette entry 0 is set to white by the king's quest 7 title card screen&
[22:35] <wanwan> isn't kq7 is (was?) a very buggy game?
[22:35] <snover> absolutely
[22:37] <wanwan> i remember playing it and at some point one character's face just physically detached from his body
[22:37] <snover> ha ha ha
[22:37] <snover> oh man.
[22:37] <snover> i look forward to the bug report on *that*
[22:37] <snover> lets see if i can even get the windows version to run
[22:37] <snover> nope. "DLL not initialized" and then crash.
[22:38] <snover> m_kiewitz: do you happen to have a less busted kq7 1.51 installation?
[22:38] <m_kiewitz> less busted?
[22:38] <wanwan> it probably tries to load 16-bit dll file
[22:38] <snover> i cant get it to run here, it just says "DLL not initialized"
[22:38] <m_kiewitz> wanwan: it isn't as bad as qfg4 floppy lol
[22:38] <snover> (running in a 32-bit XP VM)
[22:39] <m_kiewitz> then initialize the DLL, doh :P
[22:39] <snover> oh. right. of course! :~)
[22:42] <m_kiewitz> oh, it requires win32s
[22:42] <m_kiewitz> i tried to install it under dos-box w/ win3.11, but it complains about win32s :(
[22:42] <snover> lets just say this particular version of kq7 seems to be extra-special.
[22:42] <snover> and everyone should just upgrade to 2.00b.
[22:44] <m_kiewitz> ah, it now worked better
[22:44] <m_kiewitz> i got it to benchmark my system for 2 minutes
[22:44] <m_kiewitz> and now it complains that it can't load 10.wav
[22:44] <snover> too fast! benchmarking forever
[22:44] <snover> uch. broken, broken.
[22:46] <m_kiewitz> no idea what it tries to do, there is no 10.wav anywhere
[22:47] <snover> its in resource.sfx
[22:48] <m_kiewitz> hmm, maybe it has issue with the game being copied to a directory of my harddrive and not in the root directory
[22:48] <m_kiewitz> urgh
[22:48] <m_kiewitz> resAud=[:\
[22:48] <m_kiewitz> resSfx=[:\
[22:49] <wanwan> :/
[22:49] <snover> ah, of course, you installed it to your [ drive
[22:49] <snover> a common mistake.
[22:49] <m_kiewitz> yeah, the [ drive. how could i
[22:49] <m_kiewitz> yes, i always do stuff like this
[22:49] <m_kiewitz> :P
[22:49] <snover> :~)
[22:49] <wanwan> try ( drive, it'll work for sure!
[22:50] <m_kiewitz> ha, works now
[22:51] <wanwan> i told ya!
[22:51] <m_kiewitz> i changed the resource.win file
[22:51] <m_kiewitz> yeah and i used the ) drive
[22:51] <m_kiewitz> snover: what shall i check?
[22:53] <m_kiewitz> what the hell did they do, "[" is the char after the ASCII alphabet. How can they get [ when there is no CD-ROM drive
[22:55] <wanwan> come on, for(driveLetter = 'A';driveLetter <= 'Z';driveLetter++) if(isCDDrive(driveLetter)) break;
[22:56] <m_kiewitz> but who would do that...
[22:56] <m_kiewitz> oh my
[23:00] <wanwan> obviously, they expected you to have a cd-rom drive, or how would you get that game in first place?
[23:01] <m_kiewitz> i wonder how they tested their installer
[23:01] <m_kiewitz> did they create fresh CDs every time?
[23:02] <wanwan> probably used some dummy CDs
[23:03] <wanwan> or temporarily disabled that check, so any drive would work
[23:04] <wanwan> recordable media back then was ridiculously expensive
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[23:05] <m_kiewitz> yes back then
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[23:12] <snover> m_kiewitz: sorry about that. the intro video from the main menu, whether it is surrounded by white or black
[23:14] <m_kiewitz> snover: http://i.imgur.com/uY2QIDg.jpg
[23:15] <snover> well thats annoying. i wonder what is different in scummvm&
[23:15] <snover> i kind of feel like just forcing that palette entry to black and moving on
[23:15] <m_kiewitz> if we can upscale it, we should definitely do that
[23:16] <m_kiewitz> maybe they also cleared the screen
[23:16] <m_kiewitz> i wouldn't be surprised, the kq6 portraits were also basically hacked in
[23:16] <snover> its possible. its so annoying that these win32s executables cant be disassembled
[23:20] <snover> setting the first palette entry to black when rendering the video palette takes addresses the problem. i feel pretty OK with just doing this for KQ7 1.51.
[23:21] <snover> kShowMovie didnt get used very much
[23:23] <snover> hax.
[23:25] <snover> oh, what the wingwang. the *video* sets palette entry 0 to white.
[23:25] <snover> how did this ever& how& i& urgh.
[23:31] <snover> i guess it worked because they palette shifted everything in the engine in win32s
[23:33] <snover> I think I might leave this for someone else to deal with in the future&
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[23:44] <snover> actually it might not even be the shift&
[23:45] <snover> it must actually be that VfW manages its own separate internal palette
[23:45] <snover> la dee da. super ugly.
[00:00] --- Fri Aug 5 2016